www.justiceforchandra.com

[Nancy]

[rd]

"And her bank cards not used anyway."

I wrote that in 2018, and I recall there was a statement that her bank account was not used after she disappeared, but looking for it.

It's stated in Wikipedia article:
Her bank account keycard has not been used since her disappearance.
(This is in a statement credited to CBS News)

I have seen that info several times, possibly in statement from Drew or OPD as well. I don't know about a purse, but I believe she would at least have had a billfold for drivers license and bank card.

When you have that, two cell phones, and an iPod, she's carrying that around in something, at least out to the car.

[rd]

"The "final event" pings emitting from both phones minutes apart but from the same location leaves no doubt that both phones were together that evening. However, can we be sure this is true as our only source is from Mr. and Mrs. Kesses' statements supporting it, and they now appear hell-bent on making us believe it never happened?"

Well they for sure are hell-bent on pretending it never happened. I quoted it multiple times from a 2014 post by Drew in his Guest blog.

I have analyzed that statement every time I quoted it. It is clearly correct technical jargon either directly from a carrier trained technician or relayed via OPD as told to them.

Drew and these idiot podcasters like the one above like to talk about the state of technology in 2006 but the technology of recording contacts to cell towers is still basically the same. There's potentially additional info these days but cell phone ID and date/time of contact are unambiguous proof the cell phone was in contact with the cell tower at that time. Period. End of story.

Even the fundamental nature of being in contact with multiple towers is regarded with disbelief by these people. Instead they mumble stuff about "location of cell phone" not being reliable in 2006 when that is not what is being done with a list of contacts with the cell phone the carrier retrieves from storage upon timely request by law enforcement. Has nothing to do with precisely locating a cell phone.

I'm not saying that some of that can't be done with additional info stored now but that isn't purpose of asking carriers what towers cell phone was in contact with when. The purpose is to get the list.

From that some generalizations can be drawn. For example, let's say the answer was several towers in a direction away from her home, such as east or west, with the later contacts being on towers farther away, indicates she moved in that direction before disappearing.

Not seeing that also indicates something, that she didn't move in a particular direction from home during time of recorded pings.

Not seeing any change in ping activity before 10 and after 10 would have indicated she never left home with the cell phone operable.

Seeing a change from before 10 to after 10 but random towers would indicate movement in the area but not a beeline away from home, say just driving over to Millenia Mall or a relatively short distance away on Conroy such as near HOTG.

The exact location of her cell phone won't be known, but the time and tower locations give indications of her relative movement during the time provided by the carriers, assuredly information for both phones was requested.

It doesn't take a genius to draw whatever conclusions can be drawn from the information, and the investigators have surely had the opportunity to draw it, but indications of movement locally with cell phones becoming disabled between 10:20 and 10:40 is what it appears to be from the technician's quote.

[Nancy]

Well, I think they have to believe the ping study was "faulty" because if it wasn't it means accepting that Jennifer went out at some point in the evening.

That seems to be where the problem lies.

In the Fox podcast "House of Broken Dreams", Mrs. Kesse says that Jennifer would not have gone out in the middle of the night. She has great emotion and conviction in her voice as she makes that statement.

My heart breaks for her.

But who is saying Jennifer went out in the middle of the night?

Surely she is not suggesting around 10 pm is the middle of the night.

I really don't understand their resistance.

Even the most recent info suggesting a struggle on the hood of Jennifer's vehicle--I doubt very much if that happened around 7:30 am with the lawn maintenance people arriving. YMMV

[Nancy]

[rd]

Nancy, I was doing some research on your question about could it be at night (I don't think so, but wanted to find the source of the reasons why). In doing the search I came across some images of POI, and looking at an image page I see all of mine are shown attributed to here, which is a good thing.

Then I saw a question on POI image 3 looking back from tree and see there is a Reddit on Jennifer Kesse. I don't scoot around the web much on this, websleuths was pretty much only other site I read until they stopped the posting, but as I visit Reddit everyday for technical forums I'll join that group. It is r/jenniferkesse

So I'm still looking at some search results to give a better answer than I'm pretty sure they determined it was noon. :)

One thing that I recall threw people off was that car enters with headlights on in the other camera video and was so dark it looked like night. But jane from this site pointed out that that model of car ran with headlights on, something I was completely unaware of that some cars did. So that was a good find. She also is one that first suggested top of head was a bicycle helmet with which I concurred.

But OPD looked at equipment, rest of tape that these images come from, the other camera tapes, etc. and determined it was noon. Also the image details while we think are sparse in this would be missing in a night time video where images are only ascertained with infrared reflection.

It's that infrared that remained on during day either because camera was cheap and didn't have it disabled in light or the shutter to block infrared source was broken, which is also likely on a cheap camera, and I'm pretty sure we can all agree this was not high end equipment.

But it's certainly better than nothing which many other places had, including Mosaic at time and my own apartment complex elsewhere in Florida at time. So it was pretty significant help that HOTG had this in place.

[rd]

I will resume looking at search results on the night question but regarding could POI be removing his coveralls as he's walking, I would say do we think he was wearing coveralls?

I will say that in the images of the other camera that little can be seen but that POI looks like a snowman in them. I would say images are consistent with a mass covering of same IR reflectivity, and coverall would fit that bill. Was there some other basis for thinking he is wearing coveralls I forgot or missed?

I can't really see anything that says one way or the other, Nancy. I would just say it didn't slow him down any. He made it through the 4 images (last one empty, just the tree) in 3 seconds or less.

[Nancy]

Well, a couple of things:

I'm familiar with Reddit. Not a fan, but I do read there occasionally. Let me know if you find anything better than what we have here.

Websleuths has re-opened a thread for discussion.

Yeah, I know he is really just a blob until he gets to the gate, but I thought we discussed him as appearing to have long sleeves on in that part and short sleeves on at the gate.

I guess that's what gives me the idea he could be wearing coveralls, or one of the things anyway.

I know LE "determined" it was noon but LE has been known to deliberately mislead at their discretion. So, just wondering.

It is surprising that the HOTG was one of the few places with surveillance video at the time, but I attribute it to the fact that the HOTG was a high-crime area. I always ask myself why the POI would choose that area to drop-off Jennifer's vehicle; and, yeah, I've read and probably re-read a ton of discussion on it.

One of the reasons I'm grateful for the somewhat useless video is that at least we know for a fact Jennifer did not drive and abandon her own vehicle at that place. Period. That is not Jennifer Kesse in that video. No how, no way.

But, I don't know. I guess I'm going to have to look at it yet again or a couple of hundred more times.

Because if the camera only shot an image every 3-seconds, he couldn't have made it to the palm tree in 3-seconds.

It doesn't make sense if we have the whole undoctored, correctly time-stamped video.

[rd]

I had just scrolled through the last year of r/jenniferkesse posts, I see the same stuff you talk about. I'd rather hear it from you.

The thread from a year ago is "archived", closed for discussion. I posted a new thread saying I don't understand reddit culture but whatever, was an interesting discussion and I was a member of reddit a year ago and would have commented. The thread was Could POI be Carrying Something?

In it the OP wasn't sure if image was fake, including the image 3 from tree. In my post I assured that images are not fake and still posted here 13 years after the work to create them.

That's interesting that they opened a thread on websleuths. I checked every few months to see if posting had resumed. Hadn't checked for awhile though.

Whatever the site, anything I post elsewhere I post here as well. It's just new source of material for discussion for me.

[rd]

I didn't state that clearly enough. I meant all 4 images total are 3 seconds or less. Some of the images have the same second on them.

I commented once (going by memory here) that in looking at the other camera images that standing by car I saw extended arms which were light. This indicated to me that arms were clothed as skin didn't reflect light like the clothes did. It's been awhile since I looked at that and commented.

In the POI images, my contention is that arms can't be seen, one way or other whether clothed or not. That's a reaction to the early contention that a short sleeved arm was swung back (way back) in a manner of an inner city bad boy. My research showed it wasn't an arm, it was an optical illusion.

That of course wasn't quite worth the effort of even saying so. People want it to be an illegal immigrant bad boy murderer rapist and stuff like facts just get in the way.

[rd]

I wanted to get some facts on the time posted:

fair use excerpts, thanks to Orlando Sentinel reporting
https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/os-xpm-2007-05-18-kesse18-story.html
Video of suspect released in case of Jennifer Kesse
Jim Leusner, Sentinel Staff Writer
May 18, 2007
ORLANDO SENTINEL

...
But after months of debate between Kesse's parents and detectives -- and solid leads exhausted -- police decided Thursday to release a grainy, out-of-focus, wide-angle surveillance-camera video showing a person who parked Kesse's car at a south Orlando condominium complex. The suspect, estimated to be 5 feet 3 inches to 5 feet 5 inches tall, then was recorded walking away by another security camera about noon Tuesday, Jan. 24, 2006.
...
The video released Thursday shows Kesse's car driven by the pool at Huntington on the Green condominiums at Texas Avenue and American Boulevard about 11:59 a.m., although the time stamp on the video is an hour ahead.

The dark, four-door Chevrolet Malibu is captured in the distance from a pool-area camera. It is seen backing into a parking space, and then the driver exits wearing a white T-shirt and walks across the screen.

About 20 seconds later, another camera captures the person walking by a fence, but the face is obstructed by a pole in the few frames released. Still frames of this scene were released last year.
...
He said four different teams of homicide and missing-persons detectives have independently reviewed the case, re-interviewed the woman's boyfriend, ex-boyfriend and other acquaintances.
...
Police have polygraphed witnesses, visited areas near the woman's home that have been unearthed during recent construction and compared leads with state and federal authorities.
...
Detectives theorize that the woman was either abducted while running an errand the night of Jan. 23 or the next morning on the way to work, he said.

The woman's missing belongings -- her identification, phone and credit cards -- have not been used, [Orlando police Lt. John] O'Grady said.

end quotes

I did not find any explanation for police determining it was noon and not night. Maybe because the POI images were released first there wasn't any question about it. When the other camera video was released, it's hard to believe it wasn't night.

Looking at the POI images:

- The image is well lit. I don't think you would see that in a night image from infrared.

- The clock says 1-24-2006 13:00:27.
If it was 12 hours off, that would be 3 hours after her 10pm call. And if adjusted for Daylight Savings Time as was said needed to be done, midnight, two hours after 10pm call.


- 12 hours off and into next day? So would be midnight to 1am 1-25-2006? The OPD had to look at this tape to see if they could find when Jennifer's car was parked. I think it would be pretty obvious from activity whether it was day or night.

On other hand, they had to look at CAM2 to actually find Jennifer's car being parked (based on where it was parked) and then based on that time find what was in CAM3 at that time. CAM2 alone I'm not sure one could tell what was going on well enough to say day or night, but CAM3 at pool gate one would be able to see all sorts of day time activity go by that gate.

In the details posted above is a lot of mentions of different things we've talked about recently. Included those references too as well as the time.

[Markybug]

Just to say , I am a mod on jenns sub on Reddit, there is only two of us though. If either of you want to help mod ? Always helpful to read new information from different sources.

As you mention websleuths is open again for comments on jenn also.

Haven’t commented much recently, but interesting re what you think is factual and what turns out not to be in this case !


Mark.

[rd]

oh, that's interesting that you're a mod there. I saw a wide range of comments on the case posted.

Thanks for asking, but my hands full as it is.

[Markybug]

[Nancy]

I've posted these before, so my apologies for the duplication. However, there's a couple of points I'd like to make and these might help me make them.

First point: considering short sleeves versus long sleeves, see the first image--CAM3 at 26 seconds past the hour.

I think that might be his actual arm showing below the short sleeve of his round neck, collarless t-shirt.

When he moves to the second post at the 27-second mark, I absolutely agree with you when you say it is not his arm. It doesn't even look like an arm to me anymore. In fact, I'm pretty sure he has his arms in front of him at that point.

Loved and appreciated your narrative on it, BTW.

What bothers me is that roll of something just below his buttocks but above his knees. Maybe it's the bottom of his backpack or cross-body bag or whatever that is on his back, but I find it's low for that to be the case. So that's where I got the idea that maybe, just maybe, he was quickly dropping his coveralls to remove them as he was walking to wherever his destination ended.

That seems silly to me at this moment, though, because I don't think a person would work on removing coveralls with a backpack or cross-body bag secured in place. Oh, well. Scratch that thought. :)

The thumbnail image is just to show where the coverall idea actually originates from. And also explains why a lot of people believe he is dressed in all one color. I guess they didn't watch the whole video, because near the end when it switches to CAM3 we see two colors of clothing.

So, as CAM2 shows, he exits Jennifer's vehicle at 11:59:44 appearing to have his arm extended and we see, possibly, "that arms were clothed as skin didn't reflect light like the clothes did".

I'm quoting you there as I don't know how to say it better. I get it, though; at least, I think I do.

Second point: the timestamps are correct on the images contained in my first image. For easier viewing, I pasted in larger stamps but deliberately left the originals in place. I didn't change anything else. You can confirm the date/time by zooming.

I find only the first 3 fit the one, two, snap idea--or camera shooting only every three seconds. The others don't seem to fall into that rhythm.

Anyway, I'm not trying to prove it was midnight or anything of the sort, just trying to understand.

Why do you suppose there weren't more people around? That's an interesting point. Orlando, Florida; high-noon on a Monday and not a soul around. More incredible luck by this POI, huh?

Surely, someday his luck will end.