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Guandique's Defense
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Rainbow



Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 866
Location: THE LEFT COAST

PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:23 pm    Post subject: Question Reply with quote

Hi everybody!
I have a quick question. Was there ever any mention of Guandique being a member of MS-13 or any other gang during the jogger trial(s)?
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jane



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Rainbow,

Wow - good question! I believe Guandique pleaded guilty to those offenses, so there would not have been a trial? I'm not sure... Can we obtain transcipts of whatever procedings took place? It would be very interesting.
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jane



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2009 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi everyone! I am thinking about Chandra's clothing on which DNA for several individuals shows up, none of which matches Guandique's. I am wondering when this testing was done, and whether the results prompted the prosecution to encourage informants to include more people supposedly involved in Chandra's murder?
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jane



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2009 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From prosecution material (in the Warrant and the Notice of Discovery) I get the feeling the prosecution wants to avoid calling Arden, who conducted the autopsy on Chandra's remains, to testify.
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Rainbow



Joined: 29 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2009 2:44 pm    Post subject: Diagnosing the Right Illness Reply with quote

Hi!
I agree. It seems like they just want to re-try Guandique for the old jogger case(s). Those women do not want him back on the streets. The new team at the MPD was not involved in working on the "real-time" Chandra case, so the "two plus two" they have put together makes them feel that they are doing the "right thing".
This is a much worse case of the "John Mark Karr" syndrome.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9273
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes, agreed, Rainbow.

jane, not a trial with the joggers. The judge's statement at sentencing is in chapter Guandique. He pleaded guilty, maybe a plea deal on lesser charges, but I doubt he knew he would get 10 years going into it.

He did give his version of what he did (attracted to walkman's, shiny objects, whatever), but was arrested in July and sentenced in September.

The DNA testing was done. I haven't finished reading the affadavit (I have to tranquilize myself to get through it), but DNA of someone handling the evidence was found and noted in the affadavit, so the evidence is contaminated.

I wouldn't doubt that not finding Guandique's DNA that the evidence is deliberately contaminated as they so uncharacteristically helpfully point out in the affadavit. Also DNA testing is not cheap and would not be paid for by court or government as a requirement of law, etc. Not sure if Public Defenders have a fund for this but sounds like it for them to say they are going to retest.

rd
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jane



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess the defense wants DNA from other suspects processed and compared with the mixture found on the tights. The bra was contaminated with DNA from a female technician.
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rd



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yep, that's the DNA contamination.

rd
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Rainbow



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:45 pm    Post subject: What Brand of "Genes" Was the Victim Wearing? Reply with quote

Hi friends!
The defense strategy sounds like a good one. Do you think they are going to be successful in getting those tests done?
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jane



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Rainbow. If any of the people they want tested are convicted felons, I imagine the testing for that could go forward without a problem. I remember that a sample was collected from Gary Condit. I don't know whether samples were collected from others. I don't think there should be any problem getting testing done on such samples. If there are other people they want tested, they would have to get a warrant to obtain a sample.

I have no idea what the budget limitations would be for the public defenders. We know that DNA testing is expensive and testing ten samples would be costly.
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Rainbow



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 5:58 pm    Post subject: Innocent Until Proven Guilty Reply with quote

Hi Jane et al.!
May be Ms. Sonnenberg can receive some help from people or organizations affiliated with "The Innocence Project". Does anyone know anything about the costs involved in DNA testing?

The Mid-Atlantic Innocence Project
exonerate.org
http://www.exonerate.org/about-2/
About the Innocence Project
Board of Directors
History and Organization
Honorary Board
Mid-Atlantic Innocence Project Annual Newsletters
Staff Profiles
Student Groups
About the Innocence Project
The Mid-Atlantic Innocence Project (MAIP) is a non-profit organization that provides investigative and legal assistance to incarcerated people who have been wrongly convicted. MAIP, which was founded in 2000 as the Innocence Project of the National Capital Region, has a permanent staff of three attorneys and one program assistant and is run through a network of attorneys and law students throughout Virginia, Maryland, and the District of Columbia. Under the supervision of professors and local attorneys, students investigate claims of innocence from prisoners in cases involving DNA evidence or other newly discovered evidence of innocence. Pro bono attorneys then take over those cases in which the students have found a potentially demonstrable claim of innocence.

We also work to educate judges, lawmakers, and the public on the causes of wrongful convictions. The wave of post-conviction DNA exonerations in recent years has proven beyond a reasonable doubt that wrongful convictions occur with alarming regularity. DNA exonerees are, in a sense, the "fortunate" ones who were accused of crimes in which the actual perpetrator left biological evidence at the scene. The vast majority of crimes do not involve biological evidence, but they pose the same risk of wrongful convictions. With these crimes, the wrongfully convicted defendant may never find a way of proving his or her innocence. Thus, even though DNA testing now is widely conducted before trial rather than after conviction, reducing the risk of wrongful conviction in cases involving biological evidence, it is still absolutely essential that we as a society address and remedy the causes of wrongful conviction that can play a role in any case. We believe that progress can be made through improved laws, an educated judiciary, and an informed public.

Our mission is to seek the exoneration and release of persons who have been convicted of crimes that they did not commit in Maryland, Virginia, and the District of Columbia.

Here is the link to the website for the national "Innocence Project".
http://www.innocenceproject.org/about/
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Rainbow



Joined: 29 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:23 pm    Post subject: Causes of Wrongful Convictions Reply with quote

The "Innocence Project" website lists the causes of wrongful conviction. They are:

Eyewitness Misidentification
Unvalidated or Improper Forensic Science

False Confessions / Admissions

Government Misconduct
Informants or Snitches
Bad Lawyering

Please refer to the link below for the list and the rest of the article I have posted.

http://www.innocenceproject.org/understand/Government-Misconduct.php

One of the causes is government misconduct:

Government Misconduct

Some wrongful convictions are caused by honest mistakes. In some cases, however, officials take steps to ensure that a defendant is convicted despite weak evidence or even clear proof of innocence.

The cases of wrongful convictions uncovered by DNA testing are replete with evidence of fraud or misconduct by prosecutors or police departments.

A few bad apples
Most law enforcement officers and prosecutors are honest and trustworthy. But criminal justice is a human endeavor and the possibility for corruption exists. Even if one officer of every thousand is dishonest, wrongful convictions will continue to occur.

DNA exonerations have exposed official misconduct at every level and stage of a criminal investigation. This misconduct has included:

deliberate suggestiveness in identification procedures
the withholding of evidence from defense
the deliberate mishandling, mistreatment or destruction of evidence
the coercion of false confessions
the use of unreliable government informants or snitches
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DNA testing is very expensive. I saw the figure recently but don't recall the exact amount. I believe it was tens of thousands of dollars.

The Innocence Project had a major win just a couple of days ago. And yes, the most common reasons cited were at fault. I am going to add that article to the thread. It's from Houston, but exactly what is going on here. Nasty, nasty stuff from these Washington police and prosecutors.

It is totally irrelevant to pursue DNA testing as I posted above. Once known to be contaminated, any results would be dismissed, possibly even suppressed if they included someone these Washington people were protecting.

rd
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jane



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
Posts: 3225

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Rainbow and rd! rd - the thing is, they do already have results, but nobody to match them to. There is DNA from more than one person on the tights (none of which is a match for Guandique). The defense wants to test DNA from at least ten suspects to see whether any of it mataches any of the DNA found on the tights.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of the matches made is to an examiner. That means it's contaminated.

Also, DNA results when obtained are routinely fed to a DNA database for matches just like the fingerprint database. That's how they would have got the examiner match I believe, but don't have any info on.

The point is, once known to be contaminated, any matches made are potentially cross contamination, i.e. a person handling evidence introducing DNA from other evidence, for example DNA obtained from Condit.

Yes, improbable, but if a match were made potential cross-contamination issues would be basis for asking court to suppress results from being made known if the match was someone they wanted to protect.

Back to the matching thing, when Project Innocence wins, like a couple of days ago, they are able to 1) get permission to test, 2) pay for DNA testing, 3) get DNA testing done of evidence, and 4) have results matched to the DNA database of which their client has been added.

Not only does the client not match to win, but in this case DNA matches were made to two currently incarcerated felons in the 20+ year old rape case.

Not matching to client alone is enough, but finding out the match others in the database shows whose DNA actually is on it. Of course with the same issues in Houston as cited, potential cross contamination basically makes the results worthless as far as convicting other people but shows that client's DNA wasn't a match and other people's were versus bad or incomplete DNA test results. Still, doesn't require a match of another person to know the results were bad or incomplete.

In this case Guandique's DNA is not on evidence and that's what Project Innocence tests for. If someone else were convicted like Condit they might be persuaded to pay for his DNA to be tested to see if on evidence, etc.

I don't have any idea why anyone would be talking about testing DNA of anyone else, much less ten people. The lawyers are public defenders. The defense isn't going to pay for this testing, and the court isn't going to pay for it, and the prosecution isn't going to pay for it, so apparently it's part of a reasonable doubt basis, saying to jury could be one of these ten other people if we did the DNA testing, but DNA testing wasn't done, etc.

rd
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