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Jennifer Kesse Disappearance Discussion continued
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9273
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 3:30 pm    Post subject: Jennifer Kesse Disappearance Discussion continued Reply with quote

Thread to continue questions and comments on Jennifer Kesse disappearance. Feel free to quote or copy and paste from other threads to reply to.

rd

Blowup of Jennifer Kesse person of interest / suspect

click to read the online true crime mystery novel Murder on a Horse Trail: The Disappearance of Chandra Levy

www.justiceforchandra.com home page
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2021 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The strangest element of the Jennifer Kesse case is the planning.

If an abductor sees someone they want to take and knows where this person lives and when they leave for work, wouldn't they plan the abduction?

...How do you think the abductor planned this crime?
It is the planning that is the strangest part of this case.


Good questions. To me all indications are a crime of opportunity that occurred about 10:20 PM probably in a parking lot near her condo, perhaps at Millenia Mall. By opportunity I mean someone waiting somewhere for a chance to assault, which is planning.

I believe her car was dumped at a nearby apartment complex (down the main drag a mile or so) convenient to bus stops at the corners both N-S (Texas) and E-W (Americana) to make it unclear where he might have gone. I think the car was deliberately parked in as prominent spot as possible to point suspicions toward residents of the apartment complex and indicate Jennifer may have been visiting there, etc. Car could have been parked in HOTG in obscure parking areas along Texas which merely looks like car is being dumped. Not the desired effect.

By as prominent as possible I don't mean pre-planned spot, I just mean drove in and parked up front rather than turn up or down along Texas and park by street, which also would have avoided surveillance. Indications are wanted the car to raise suspicion about a perpetrator at HOTG and didn't know about the surveillance cameras.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2021 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But if it happened at night why wait until 12 noon to drop off Jennifer Kesse's car at HOTG? And what a long night. I am surprised the POI would not be very tired trying to go to work.

The answer is morbid, but I would expect that Jennifer was kidnapped in a parking lot and removed via a van to the abductor's home, and that in those situations the victim is not killed right away. That's why her body hasn't been found. She was removed from the area that night.

I would expect the abductor went to the parking lot next day, moved her car, and either went to work or returned to his vehicle in the parking lot. I am assuming a large parking lot such as Millenia Mall, and there was good reason to suspect that Jennifer might have gone over there to possibly even give the phone to her ex who was there for him to take care of, as he was at her condo that weekend with brother and friend who left phone.

Along those same lines, the POI does not appear to have just engaged in a 4 hour abduction, rape, and murder and then casually parks her car and walks back to work or whatever.
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Nancy



Joined: 11 Jul 2018
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2021 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jennifer was born 40 years ago today. I wish I could type that tonight when I close my eyes, I'll believe that she is resting peacefully. But that would be a lie.

Jennifer needs to be found and the person who committed this horrible crime needs to be brought to justice.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2021 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beautiful sentiments, Nancy. So sad.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 26, 2021 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What would be amazing would be to be provided access to the information that is being withheld so progress on Jennifer's disappearance could be made.

The video of the pool gate where those stills were taken from. Any other people seen would give indications of the contortion of the image and discoloration of clothes. Also the test video of themselves the OPD made.

The make and model of the surveilance cameras and the recording deck used. The settings of the equipment so that the recording could be reenacted and compared.

The list of times and locations of contact with cell towers from Jennifer's phone and the friends work phone (a Nextel), as much as was provided by the phone companies to give an indication for example when contact picked up from a quiet period, and when it stopped, and everything in between.

All of this information has been sought since the beginning. There is a definite lack of interest in technical analysis from those that have had it. And Jennifer's disappearance gets colder because of it.
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rd



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2021 5:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's interesting the landline wasn't mentioned for years, then there was this stuff about such poor signal in Jennifer's condo that she would go to balcony to use her cell phone? And was unclear about evening's phone calls on cell phone or landline, but police report listed a range of time in the evening that calls were on cell phone.The couldn't use her cell phone in her condo appears to be misinformation as well, came along with that landline info?

That changes things quite a bit. Cell towers handled that phone call ending just before 10 pm. There is at least an indication that unusual cell tower locations were in contact with the Verizon and/or Nextel cell phones shortly after 10 pm. ("Can't be in two places at once" from Drew).

Quite frankly, coming off a phone call, the Verizon cell phone wouldn't be looking for a new contact tower unless it was moving out of range of the tower that transmitted the last call. You wouldn't have ping activity like that unless looking for a replacement tower contact due to moving out of range.

How can such fundamental information be ignored because of desire to make Jennifer's abduction at her car in the morning going to work?
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2021 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The info that Drew posted was quite technical in nature (clearly info from a technician) and fairly involved. Not something that can be brushed off with I misheard. In addition, the source of the analysis, the ping records, are being withheld.

Not to get technical, but "location" has always been confusing because people misconstrue as a location of the cell phone at the time. And yes, determination of location of the cell phone has undergone technical advances since 2006.

However, location refers to location of the cell towers where the pings were recorded. There is nothing ambiguous or technically evolving about location of a cell tower. The phone company(s) generated a report of recorded contacts of the ID of Jennifer's cell phone. Nothing could be simpler, and there is zero ambiguity about it. I believe the Nextel ID contact info was also sought and should be in that printout.

That's all it is. A printout, as anyone who ever printed a report has done. List entries where cellphone ID was recorded at certain cell towers on 1/23/2006. Nothing could be simpler to understand. There are just some people that don't like what's in the report.
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Vivian



Joined: 19 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 9:54 pm    Post subject: Phone ping records Reply with quote

What would these records look like that indicated which towers Jennifers phone was pinging off of ? Would it look like a map of Orlando with cirlces indicating the location of these towers ? Have a reason for asking ...
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure, glad you're asking. It all helps.

It's just a contact listing. Some key fields:
cell phone ID (they would have specified Jennifer's and the Nextel ID's)
cell tower ID (some numbering sequence multiple carriers would know - from that carriers would know the street address of tower)
date/time stamp

That's the fundamentals. There could be additional internal info with it based on things we know happens with these contacts. For example an indication whether tower was made control tower for the cell phone at that time. When a call is made to a cell phone, the ring is transmitted from the cell tower currently cell tower of record for the cell phone.

As you're driving around, for example, cell phone will seek another cell tower when current one is going out of range. Text and voice continue to be handled by cell tower of record unless cell phone switches to another tower. That's why multiple towers on listing indicates cell phone was seeking a control tower. Of course it might do that if not moving if signal is weakened or interfered with for some reason and cell phone thinks it's going out of range. But in general that's how cell phone continues phone calls as you're driving around. Control is switched from last cell tower to another one that can handle call in a different location you've moved to.

So what can anyone with that info do with it? They can draw those circles you mentioned. An average cell phone range I have read several times through years is about a mile and a half, especially at that time in 2006. I did a lot of research on multiple cases in those years concerning cell phone coverage.

Certainly you can get some variance in range based on terrain and other things affecting broadcast. The bottom line is if a cell tower recorded cell phone ID as contacting at a certain time, the cell phone was in contact with that tower at that time. And it could be in contact with two widely separated towers seconds apart. Has nothing to do with physically travelling between the two towers in those seconds (can't be in two places at once, etc.) It just means cell phone was able to broadcast to multiple towers as it was seeking a control tower. And the contacts were recorded.

Depending on time and location of the contacts, some overlap in the circles could indicate general area where cell phone was when contacts were made. It's not a cell phone location thing, it's just an indication that to be able to broadcast to multiple towers relatively close in time a range from each tower that would enable that. Unless the Kesses for example were given the tower locations from that listing they wouldn't be able to do anything like that and it makes the info something they can't understand. Hard to tell what was divulged to them.

Lastly, there are frequent references to cell location broadcasting, something requested by LE to locate a cell phone. In that the carrier broadcasts from multiple towers simultaneously and measures time of response from the cell phone ID. This has to be requested by LE. Normal cell phone contact records are nothing like that. It's just random as to when a cell phone might contact a tower going about its business and be recorded. That's what the listing will contain, which also has to be requested by LE, but in form of where do you have record of cell phone ID in general area on such and such date. Has to be requested relatively quickly, like within 30 days, lots of data and its rolled over. But you can't get any details on any of this, apparently considered sensitive information, even cell tower locations, from what little I could find about it through years.

Thanks for asking, Vivian. Hope that helps.
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Vivian



Joined: 19 Sep 2015
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Location: GA

PostPosted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 11:26 pm    Post subject: Jennifer Kesse Reply with quote

About three years ago I was friends with a person on one of the many Jennifer Kesse Discussion groups that I keep up with ....He sent me a paper with cell tower locations around the Mosaic where Jennifer lived ..Recently in going through my Jennifer Kesse notes I found it .....It has 12 pings on it , no times or cell phone numbers but these circles are numbered 1 to 12 ....I don't know if this is legit or not , this person said that he was in law enforcement ....One thing that I have noticed is these pings seem to coincide with searches that have been done for Jennifer ....The last ping was around the Sand Lake , Dr. Phillips Hospital area which I believe is near Turkey Lake Road , I believe a search was conducted on or near Turkey Lake Road .....
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rd



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PostPosted: Tue Jan 04, 2022 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting, Vivian. If it is 12 different cell tower locations then are there other designated cell towers on the map that aren't circled? I did see some mention of about 12 pings believed to be on the listing but I wouldn't expect each one to be a different cell tower. Of course it could be, but that's some distance covered in a short amount of time if there is anything to the last contact around 10:20 to 10:40 pm.

If that's all the towers on the map, then it would just seem to be here's the range of all the towers in Jennifer's area. If it's some fo the towers on the map, and the numbers 1 to 12 show a general direction, then of course that's ideal and what investigators would look for. But those are two big If's.

Not having any time of contact on those 12 towers is something that investigators wouldn't omit, it's a huge part of the picture. So that raises some questions about purpose of the map.
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Vivian



Joined: 19 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2022 11:04 pm    Post subject: Jennifer Kesse Reply with quote

Inside of each designated circle is a smaller , black circle that I believe denotes a cell tower (It looks like a keyhole to me)...I am computer illiterate or I would send it to you to look at ...My husband downloaded it , it is in my files but I am unable to send it to anyone ...Hopefully , when he gets the time he can help me with it ....I remember Drew mentioned that there were 11 pings when OPD talked to them about Jennifers cell phone pinging away from her condo ....It looks like she went towards LB McLeod, towards John Young Parkway , I 4, Holden Heights , Rio Grande Ave.(I remember that OPD got a call from a woman who said Jennifer was being held at 1414 40th ST. near Rio Grande, , then toward Skylake, Florida Turnpike , Tangelo Park and ended near Sand Lake , Dr. Phillips Hospital....It is probably not a true indicator of where her phone was pinging but there have been searches done near most if not all of the areas pinged ....
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rd



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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2022 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not sounding like a map of her drive with pings. We know for a fact that two towers were pinged near the same time but they are far apart, hence Drew's can't be in two places at once comment. Unless there is a cell tower number, then next number is far away, then next number is back close to the first number, it is not a map of the pings. And like I say, I would expect times with those numbers if it was a map of her pings.

If someone just generated a map of cell towers in the area and numbered them 1 to 12, then that looks like a progression of a trip, but it's just numbering towers one after another. There would have to be something like other towers on the map that aren't numbered, and the numbered ones meander through them to even be possible as a map of her pings. And without the time of ping, and those two towers far apart that pinged near same time, it just doesn't look like a map that represents her movements with what little we know about it.

You would have to ask yourself, if I drew circles around all the towers on the map and numbered them 1 to 12, clockwise or counter clockwise or in some general sweep, would it look like this map?

First and foremost would be are there other cell towers (look like keyholes or whatever) on the sheet of paper but uncircled and unnumbered. Then you're talking 12 particular cell towers were chosen out of all of them and numbered. Then that's something.

But if all the cell towers are circled and numbered, then it's just a map of cell towers in Jennifer's area at the time. Which maybe the LE guy thought was helpful and it would be if the cell phone contact list that Drew has could be identified to which tower at what time from the list. So it's up to Drew.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2022 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my personal but lack of any experience in this area opinion, the clothing laying on her bed is more indicative of came back from a several day trip and planning my business clothing for the rest of the week. She had already been to work Monday wearing something she brought with her on trip to be able to go straight to work Monday. It just strikes me as an evening planning thing rather than a morning indecisive thing.

However, any concept that she got up Tuesday morning and did anything ignores what didn't happen. There was no indication her phone was working, therefore no alarm clock she used her phone for. There was not even a text to her bf good morning or anything else. The trash can had next to nothing in it as I understand it. Try going all evening, night, and morning going to work and not throwing anything away in the trash.

None of this is even remotely reasonable, not even taking into consideration the ignored ping movement after 10 pm, and all because the family doesn't want to consider that Jennifer got into her car and drove somewhere at 10 pm at night, despite all indications she did so.
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