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30 year old Georgia teacher Tara Grinstead missing
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gozgals



Joined: 28 Jul 2005
Posts: 3353
Location: A Place Called Vertigo

PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 11:24 pm    Post subject: No Way! Reply with quote

I can't see a hitman (which makes it a stranger as mentioned) strolling into a little town such a Ocilla. This would be far to noticeable by a community where everyone knows everybody's business. It would not be plausible, at least for that reason and a few others we can think of. Some of these so -called hitman go directly to LE with the information when asked to do a hit.

Then there is the Bubba type hitman, the small town guy who would chicken out of from doing the hit and run to the police for a deal of some sort. Then, of course he would have told eight of his friends about being hired (if he was a local) say a three counties over Bubba hitman and I have read about theses shady type Bubba's too. They are usually hired in a bar that is a whole in the wall, somewhere in another little town.

Hope my Bubba story was not confusing.

First teen lover that comes to mind is the Pam Smart case. It is usually for the reason you stated--Sex. I don't buy into this either and it does not fit Tara's case.

No hitman, no Bubba hitman and no teen lover, it leaves us with who_____________?


Goz
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9241
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the silent ex.

Here's my reply to a recent email asking what is a silent ex:

Silent ex is I guess an original of mine that came to describe what remained when women disappeared. If, for example, they cooperated with an investigation and took a lie detector test to help the police clear them, being the primary suspect based on experience, then they wouldn't be a silent ex.

But they don't. They make one statement about the missing women being suicidal or a runaway, and then are silent as her family and loved ones search for her with broken hearts and we do what we can here on the internet.

Harper is a classic silent ex. Behind every one of them is a missing women.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For those who have posted elsewhere that they believe Tara left willingly without her cell phone that night, wouldn't it be unusual to come home at 11 on a Saturday night, put your cell phone in a charger, and then willingly leave in someone else's car at midnight or later?

Oh, and did I mention this was Ocilla? Where exactly does one willingly go at that time of night with someone else, and oops, don't want to be bothered, let's leave the cell phone?

And why is the disarray in the bedroom with a clock under her bed and her lampshade knocked cockeyed ignored by those who think she willingly took off in the middle of the night?

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2007 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Concerning Tara's comings and goings in a small town like Ocilla around the time she disappeared, the pageant she helped in was in another town, so part of being in a small town is going to bigger towns for events.

The barbeque party to watch a football game was a couple of blocks away, with friends and co-workers (her principal or school board member was the neighbor who had the barbeque, IIRC).

So big town suburbs or small town, friends and neighbors gather in back yards for get togethers. But going to a pageant in another town was a coming and going.

By the way, from the info we have Tara was carrying multiple classes for her advanced degree and was driving to other towns for those classes multiple nights a week.

One of the required duties is to investigate all the people she came into contact with in all those comings and goings, but the irony is that in disappearing from her home in the middle of the night on a weekend night it rules out being attacked on one of those coming amd goings or even of being followed directly home.

Would have required a stalker, which is hard to do in a small town neighborhood without being noticed.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2007 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The standard MO for a silent ex is to give an interview right after the woman disappears intimating she is a suicidal runaway or run off with some unknown stranger.

Then they hide behind a defense lawyer and refuse to answer questions from the police and otherwise help the police in the investigation, or for that matter, answer questions from anyone.

Once they get their unwitnessed version of a hysterically suicidal woman out, they go silent.

Silent ex. There's one behind almost every missing woman.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In considering what can best be done to move Tara's case forward constructively, I would say that at this point unless something could be determined that would help indicate where Tara's remains were, that it isn't much help.

My point is that searching for Tara's remains is the only useful thing to do now. Even when we have almost universal agreement that the silent ex has made her disappear, nothing much can be done unless and until the missing woman is found.
That's not easy to say, but unfortunately true now for several missing women cases.

That's why they keep disappearing.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The people close to Tara are known, and possible connections to places they might have hid Tara's body are as known as they're going to be. So I think that not much useful is accomplished in assigning percentages of possibility to the small number of men close to Tara.

Good people in Ocilla have already spemt considerable time and effort searching for Tara's remains, but unfortunately, either we wait for another turtle hunter's dog to come across a skull or a more systematic effort is continued.

But silent ex's have become very successful at hiding women's bodies, and I believe we're going to have to take a different tact these days. We have to put into place a system integrated with 911 that lets any woman who feels threatened, or feels she will be threatened when trying to break away, have a cell phone whose signals are forwarded by phone companies to monitoring centers that record their whereabouts.

And just as importantly, record where and when the signals stop.

We also should provide to any woman being threatened by a man, such as going through divorce or estrangements, especially women in close living quarters with the man, with a panic button transmitter to wear which would transmit location and also make a 911 voice call.

We have to protect women from disappearing at the hands of control freak ex's, otherwise known as silent ex's after the woman disappears.

rd
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jane



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
Posts: 3280

PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi rd. Yes, I was thinking along the lines of prevention also, since it is so dismal once the situation goes out of control. (Out of the right kind of control, but into the obsessive abuser's control).

But I keep going further back - to when girls are being raised, when they begin dating. I wish I had the answers. But, certainly there should be better resources for women in dire straits, as you say.
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who knew that men, granted they were control freaks, but still supposedly honorable men such as cops, would become so brazen about making an inconvenient woman disappear?

They are as brazen as the sexual predators stalking our streets looking for their next victim.

We need to monitor those we know are predators, and monitor endangered women from the unknown.

The predators have become brazen. We need to respond just as forcefully to protect our society. It's too late when we are only trying to figure out where the body was hidden.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Elizabeth Smart's father described a police lie detector test as three hours of hell. Gary Condit's lawyer Geragos described his client's lie detector test as three questions, three pre-arranged, prepared for questions. That isn't a lie detector test, and to even refer to it as one is to play into the hands of people like Harper and his defense lawyer.

Look at the case of almost every missing woman with a silent ex, and you'll find a lawyer denouncing lie detector tests while simultaneously arranging for one for their poor "misunderstood" client.

My heart weeps.

Yes, part of that hell is being told you're failing, you're a liar, tell us what really happened. Innocent people stand up to it with the conscience of an innocent person.

People who have something to hide know they can't stand up to it. Just a token statement in profile on what it's like to have been stalked by the now missing woman is all they have to offer, thank you.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The very notion of Tara "leaving" her house with someone at midnight or later is quite ridiculous.

Also, any comments from friends of Tara about leaving in a normal situation are not applicable to the middle of the night.

The reason silent ex's only token statement is an implication the missing woman is crazy is for reasons like this.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Concerning an LE type person knowing better than to use their own vehicle to transport the missing woman, in theory, maybe, but not reality. Even recently the silent ex's of Stacy Peterson and Jesse Marie Davis loaded their bodies into their vehicles (in a drum and wrapped in a rug, respectively).

Theresa Parker was loaded into her own SUV but the silent ex had an excuse for coming back (to pick up his boat).

Harper couldn't leave his truck parked there while he drove off in Tara's car, and he's not in a position to "borrow" someone else's vehicle for this act, which by the way is extremely unlikely to be premeditated anyway to plan for something like acquiring a different vehicle to murder Tara.

I think Harper walking to and from his parents house a few blocks away and driving around in Tara's car is too easy to be seen by the time he would be driving back. I think he did consider something like that, like maybe driving her car off the road in the nearby creek and walking back or something, and the car shows that effort, but he probably left in the truck to go hide Tara's body.

Way too much chance to be seen in such a small town and quiet streets to do that in my opinion.

The seat back and all concerning Tara's car is I believe in the initial rush to figure out what to do with Tara. My thoughts were that they would drive down the road a little bit and perhaps off the road to make it look like an accident, but decided against it, perhaps findng difficulty in moving and arranging Tara's body, etc.

Or just as simple as wanting to make it look like Tara's car was used to transport her which would throw off searching for the vehicle used to transport her.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The disarray in Tara's bedroom does not sound staged to me. (a clock under the bed? I don't think so).

Also, not a chance Tara leaves her house with someone, quite frankly at 5 in the morning, to clear the air or whatever from a confrontation.

Yes, the person only needs the keys but criminy, they are simulating a woman running away. The ex always hides the purse.

The clock under the bed is more of something not found and straightened up versus something deliberately messed up. The lampshade may have not been able to be straightened up or was made wobbly and collapsed. It's disarray, but signs of disarray that creep through, not deliberate.

The shoes are the same thing. It's rather obvious. The missing woman if found needs shoes, otherwise it points at someone kidnapping her from her bedroom rather than running off and being murdered by an unknown stranger.

You have to think like a desperate man who has to get rid of his ex-girlfriend's body after he is driven to strangle her for probably multiple reasons.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that saying Tara was too afraid to say she was afraid is a big time catch-22. Without some kind of demonstration she was afraid to be around him, or some solid info from a family member that she did confide that, I don't think it'd be right to judge what Tara might or might not have done because she was "afraid" of Harper.

On the other hand, Harper was with his cop buddy til 4:30 in the morning. A truck was seen in front of Tara's at 5 am, and Tara's car seat was moved back. Tara may not have been afraid, but Harper knocking on her door at 4:30 in the morning (or letting himself in with a key) is not something that leads to waking up rather rudely and getting into her car with him.

In fact, all of that just to explain her car seat being pushed back. There's so much more to explain than that, and driving off with Harper because she was madly in love isn't one of them.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Concerning a question as to whether Tara was on her computer as late as 2 am that night, based on what I know of a goal driven woman like Tara (multiple pageant winner, known for being punctual, working on a PhD with multiple night classes in multiple cities, well known high school teacher, pageant advisor, etc.), I would be surprised if Tara would do anything more than check her email when she got home at 11 Saturday night, if that.

I would consider it next to impossible that she sat at the computer at all, much less till 2 am in the morning. As I understand it, Tara also attended church. People of the achievement of Tara didn't make those achievements sitting at a computer at 2 in the morning.

rd
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