www.justiceforchandra.com

maryland missing · Joined: 08 Sep 2003 Posts: 86 Location: near Frederick

Baltimore County has several cases like Tracey's - possible domestic connection, laying stagnant. I say "could be" as this is a public board and I'm sure some of these "alleged suspects" google the cases to see who/what is talking about them.

Here's some others in Baltimore:

1985 Helen Marie Clark - no case file, no picture
1986 Bernadette Caruso http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/mpccn/bcaruso.html
1995 Tracie Mosley http://www.doenetwork.us/cases/1456dfmd.html
2002 Michelle Rust http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/mpccn/rust_michelle.html

There's also a case called the "Susan Harrison" case which was never prosecuted. http://www.findingsusan.com/index.html
_________________
Maryland's Missing persons
www.marylandmissing.com

BUTTERFLY · Joined: 18 May 2005 Posts: 18 Location: anne arundel co, MD

BUTTERFLY · Joined: 18 May 2005 Posts: 18 Location: anne arundel co, MD

Candlelight vigil in honor of Tracey Gardner-Tetso

Wed, July 6 at 8pm friends, family and concerned persons will hold a vigil on the 4 month anniversary of the disappearance of Tracey. She disappeared on Sunday, March 6 and has not been heard from since. Candles will be passed out to participants. We will meet in the Days Inn parking lot at 6600 Ritchie Highway, Glen Burnie, MD. Her car was found here on March 17.

Family and friends have been conducting searches on their own and holding various fundraising to help with searches and reward money. Motley Crue posted an additional $10,000. toward her reward fund. Fund is at 22, 000.00 now. To date her estranged husband, Dennis Tetso has not helped with any of the searches or fundraisers even though he has been personally invited, nor has he had any contact with Traceys family.

We are hoping for a good turnout, please join us in a show of support not just for Tracey but for all missing persons to help us get the word out there.
_________________
We will not forget you or ever give up on you Tracey. We love you!!!

www.findtraceygardner.com

benn · Joined: 19 Sep 2002 Posts: 2136 Location: Sacramento, CA

>>>We are hoping for a good turnout, please join us in a show of support not just for Tracey but for all missing persons to help us get the word out there.<<<

That is a good sized reward that is being offered. I can't help but continue to believe that there have to be more efforts to prevent missing person cases like this from happening. I don't have an answer, but I do not think that just looking for missing people and hoping we will find them is the answer. Of course we want to look for them and find them, but somehow we must prevent them from going missing, or make it very difficult for them to go missing, or make it very difficult for anyone who wants to make someone go missing to escape without being found, tried, convicted, and possibly executed, depending upon the circumstances.

benn

BUTTERFLY · Joined: 18 May 2005 Posts: 18 Location: anne arundel co, MD

Benn,

You are correct. The searches help the family and friends feel like we have something important to do until she is found. The laws must be changed and spouses who can hide behind a lawyer and never take a polygraph test is so so wrong. Once Tracey is found, and she will be found we will band together to help to change these laws. There is a woman in Upper Marlboro, MD whose daughter was kidnapped, raped & burned alive who has taken that anger and sorrow and crusaded with the Stephanie Roper Foundation which is now MD Crime Victims Org. Roberta Roper has done wonders to help victims and their families and she is a role model to me to help change these laws.

These people are not missing but they have been misplaced and most of the times not on their own accord.
_________________
We will not forget you or ever give up on you Tracey. We love you!!!

www.findtraceygardner.com

benn · Joined: 19 Sep 2002 Posts: 2136 Location: Sacramento, CA

Butterfly, after I wrote my message here last night I thought about adding something, but I will add it now. This is just one thought on my part, and there must be thousands, or at least hundreds, of others who have some similar thoughts.

In so many of these missing person cases there are individuals who seem to be logical suspects, as with the husband, or former husband, in this case. In many of the cases a logical suspect may not really be a suspect at all, so care does have to be used in trying to determine who is and who is not a logical suspect. There seems to be at least one method that could be used in looking at possible suspects, and that is the method that was used in the Scott Peterson case in Stanislaus County, California. I live about fifty miles from there, so I am plugging my territory, but whatever methods that were used in the Scott Peterson case seemed to work.

The specific method that I am referring to is the putting of a GPS locator on Scott's truck by law enforcement. I do not remember the exact details now of how the locator got onto the truck. To me this seems sort of similar to wire tapping a telephone line. This is done through the courts, but it gives law enforcement additional means of gathering information.

If a locator could be put on a possible suspect's vehicle over a year's time that might begin to show some of the suspect's habits, where he went and what he did, and if he has any criminal tendencies that might begin to show up on a map of his activities made by a GPS locator.

Wire tapping certain telephones used by a possible suspect might also reveal a lot of information about the suspect that could lead to connecting him to a crime, or possibly showing him to not be a suspect.

I have not expressed this in the best way possible, but I think the general idea is here, Society can take added precautions in trying to find out who might be a real suspect in a missing persons crime, or in other crimes. Whatever was done, or was not done, in the Scott Peterson case it worked.

I have even thought that Society might be more strict in other avenues of law enforcement also, such as in the death penalty. The death sentence today, maybe taking place 20 years after a crime has happened, is really no death sentence at all. Then also there is the method of executing the condemned person. Hanging and electrocution seem to me to much more obnoxious that the injection needle now used. People hanging by the neck until death can suffer a lot of pain, but whoever was murdered probably suffered a lot of pain also, or the family suffered a lot of pain. I don't think that hanging really makes a murder's day, but a death from lethal injection might be much easier for him than if he died from cancer, or his death is easier than that of people who are actually dying from cancer.

In making it easier for condemned murderers to die Society might be making it easier for potential murderers to kill their victims. Hanging and electrocutions really do not make my day, and I don't think that they would make the day either for people on death row, which seems like one method of preventing capital offences and protecting society.

benn

rd · Joined: 13 Sep 2002 Posts: 9274 Location: Jacksonville, FL

Expressed pretty well, that's for sure, benn. It is possible that law enforcement has bugged the husband's vehicle, they would not announce it if they did. In fact, they would not want the suspect, excuse me, person of interst, to think they were bugged, otherwise they wouldn't go near the crime scene or only carefully as Peterson did when searchers were in the area.

My personal opinion is that we are letting creeps loose one crime too early to prevent murders. In this case the husband wasn't an ex-felon on probation, so getting those guys tracked with GPS wouldn't have stopped this murder. It would have cleared all those ex-felons and made it clearer who was still not cleared and not attemptiing to help clear himself.

This is one of those obvious situations that are not so easily dealt with financially, that is, when you are planning on leaving your husband it's not real wise to continue living in the same house, but often is financially necessary or legally necessary due to claims she was deserting her home and family if she moved out as clearly necessary to protect herself from the fate that befell her.

Those kind of things impact divorce financial settlements, so are not trivial issues, yet in my opinion contribute to this kind of death. It is quite obvious Tracey's life would be imperiled when she decided to leave her husband. If you're going to leave, you have to leave sooner rather than later. There should be means for a dialogue with the ex, and there shouldn't be a need for false accusations from either side, but sticking around while going out to meet the new boyfriend is just going to lead to this in many cases.

It is also just as sad that if you can make a woman disappear without leaving a trail of blood, you will get away with murder. This is proven over and over as seen here in so many sad cases of disappeared women who may later be found as Chandra was, but far too late for human forensic evidence.

Tracey's was the latest lesson in that saga, with Natalee Hollaway's persons of interests now advised by a father who is a judge that "no body, no case".

We've come a long way, baby.

rd

benn · Joined: 19 Sep 2002 Posts: 2136 Location: Sacramento, CA

Well said rd, but is that some of the lifestyle that we see on tv?

been

rd · Joined: 13 Sep 2002 Posts: 9274 Location: Jacksonville, FL

Actually, tv has a different influence than what you are suggesting, benn. The forensic tv shows that nail the guy six ways to Sunday with forensic evidence within an hour sets expectations that can't be met when you make a body disappear.

So women disappear at the hands of the man they trust when they become inconvenient. Surprise, surprise.

As to some kind of ill effect on society based on tv, I would suggest there are more law and order shows than socially decadent shows influencing our society. I would also suggest that tv viewership is down and more and more fragmented. TV doesn't have the impact that is credited to it.

I would further point out that many of the men that are the subject of our discussion watched tv in their formative years a few decades ago. Petticioat Junction and others were pointed to then as has always been done in blaming people's behavior on tv and movies and books, but Uncle Joe and the girls at Petticoat Junction and all the other shows back then I don't think can be blamed for men who make a woman disappear in silent emotional rage.

It's even hard for me to picture a guy like that sitting and watching a tv show about relationships. I doubt very much that they ever did.

I hope the vigil for Tracey brought her loved ones together in remembrance of the relationships that did matter when she was alive.

rd

benn · Joined: 19 Sep 2002 Posts: 2136 Location: Sacramento, CA

rd, well I am reading and listening to enough good sources that I am learning a few things about behavior. I was listening to a debate the other day between an Atheist and a Fundamentalist Preacher (fundamental in bible doctrine, not in politics). This was not a new debate it was a recording from a few years back.

I wish I had it right now to listen to, but I am not going to go look for it. Some Atheists are very alert to complain about what Preachers preach, don't do this, and don't do that, so this Preacher asked the Atheist how Atheists define sin. How does an Atheist determine what a sin is?

That seems to say a lot because Atheists don't have any set of rules telling them what is a sin and what is not a sin.

That is the end of what I remember from the debate. I will probably have to go back and listen to the same debate, or some similar ones. So one problem for tv, from my point of view, is how does tv determine what a sin is. If they don't know what a sin is, how can tv tell the difference between right and wrong? That seems to be tv's problem, they don't seem to know what is a sin and what is not a sin.

I heard some of that same type of information from a Preacher preaching to College students about how to bring up their children. Of course he quoted from the book of Proverbs that says, "Train up a child in the way that he should go, and when he is old he will not depart from it."

The preacher emphasized that the parents have to start training their children at their earliest possible age. Again I do not have the sermon right in front of me so I am not going to get too specific and be specifically wrong. One thing the preacher emphasized was that "No means No" when parents are telling their children what to do or not to do. If a child is told No and he continues to do what he was told not to do then their is punishment. That is my word punishment, what the preacher really said is sort of that if a child is told not to do something, and he goes ahead and does it, that he may get a thump on the leg, or some other kind of corporal punishment. This seems to be for very young children. The child begins to associate the fact that he does something that his father or mother told him not to do and he gets this pain in his leg, maybe from a light tap from the father's hand, or maybe from a small stick. (I am going to put a disclaimer on here, I am not quoting the preacher exactly because I don't have his sermon in front of me.) I think the general idea is sort of clear. Parents bring up their children the way they should go, and if the child does not go in the direction he is supposed to go then he realizes that he has done something wrong when he gets the thump on the leg, or whatever the punishment is.

The big factor here is that the longer the children are allowed to get their own ways and are not required to obey their parents the worse the children become, they do not become better. The older they get the harder they are to train. Of course the preacher was preaching to Christians. If the parents are not Christians then where do they get their set of rules from that tells them how they should bring up their children? Of course we know that different religions have different rules.

So there we are, the majority of the population has not been trained up in the way that they should go, and they are reacting accordingly. If the parents have not been trained how can they train their children?

The majority of the population does not seem to know what a sin is. God, of course, is who determines what a sin is. I am going to go back to listening to my preachers, because if I say too much here part of what I say will be wrong, and I will be preaching things that are not right also. Back to the drawing board.

If Society does not know where it is going, any road will take it there. That is a paraphrase of another quote that says: "If you don't know where you are going any road will take you there."

benn

rd · Joined: 13 Sep 2002 Posts: 9274 Location: Jacksonville, FL

The problem here is drawing some kind of societal reason for people like Scott Peterson and Gary Condit and Tracey Tetso's husband and others involved with an inconvenient woman who disappears.

You're not going to find any Atheists among them, you are going to find some pathetic enabling parents, we certainly saw that, but no way am I going to blame the parents of these men for what they did.

And do they know that making a woman disappear is a sin? Yes, they do. We all do.

Are we all better people growing up instructed in moral values? Of course. Did that stop these men from being so selfish that when a woman who loved them became inconvenient they disappeared?

No.

Moral: A selfish person cares more about themself than anything they were ever taught about the value of life. Some men are predators and need to be tracked and put away for good. Some just think they can get away with murder if they make the woman disappear.

Men like that may hear the words, benn, but selfishness lies somewhere between their ears and their heart.

rd

maryland missing · Joined: 08 Sep 2003 Posts: 86 Location: near Frederick

Murder has been around since the beginning of time. In puritan societies, in atheist societies, etc.

Everyone has the capacity to kill someone. We are created in God's likeless, and God himself "murdered." He wiped out the entire world more than once, and chose a mass murderer (Saul) as a disciple.

To truly understand homicide, we have to take all the stereotypical stuff away. Labeling them psychopaths, sociopaths, and this and that doesn't break down what truly happened. Many of these cold-blooded killers spend days upon days weeping about what they did in their jail cells. The media portrays these people as ruthless killers, but if you do research on these killers, you'll find people not too alike you and us. People who volunteered, who cared about their mothers, who loved pets, etc. Sure, not all have all the same traits, but people who kill are rarely mentally ill.

Prisons aren't filled with mentally ill people. Very few people in this population are mentally ill. What many are, and goes without saying, is emotionally disturbed. There is a difference in this that is rarely ever pointed out.

Emotional disturbances usually start in early childhood as a result of a dysfunctional home. There are different degrees. It is a direct result of not learning how to properly deal with your emotions. Many children are taught not to cry, to hold things in, and to harm people in their youths. These behaviors don't "suddenly" appear.
_________________
Maryland's Missing persons
www.marylandmissing.com

BUTTERFLY · Joined: 18 May 2005 Posts: 18 Location: anne arundel co, MD

On Wed, July 27 some kids found the remains of a person near a park. After being told this is not Tracey Gardner-Tetso the Saturday issue of Maryland Gazette reported that Bill Toohey -Baltimore County police spokesperson told the Gazette he is not ruling out this is not Tracey. It could take weeks to months before they know who this was. Where this body was found is only a couple of miles from where the person driving Traceys Trans Am parked it at the Days Inn parking lot in Glen Burnie.
There is also another woman missing from Baltimore County-Michelle Rust , she's been missing for 3 years now. Hoping for some closure.
_________________
We will not forget you or ever give up on you Tracey. We love you!!!

www.findtraceygardner.com

rd · Joined: 13 Sep 2002 Posts: 9274 Location: Jacksonville, FL

Sounds about right. Tracey's body was dumped in a park (just as Chandra was, btw), and the car parked in a place that casts doubts on her whereabouts, in a large hotel parking lot, conveniently close to a bus stop.

A ride back close to home on the bus, and mission completed. Just another inconvenient woman made to disappear.

rd