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Kelly Katherine Wagner murdered!???? Amarillo, TX

 
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peripeteia



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
Posts: 1173
Location: Nova Scotia

PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:47 am    Post subject: Kelly Katherine Wagner murdered!???? Amarillo, TX Reply with quote

Missing Person Details

Name: Kelly Katherine Wagner
Case Number: M0501002
Case Type: Endangered
Last Seen in: Amarillo (Potter County)
Last Seen on: 12/27/2004
Height: 5' 1 "
Weight: 105 lbs.
Age Missing: 28
Eye Color: Blue
Hair Color: Blonde
Date of Birth: 12/27/1976
Race: White
Sex: Female
State Missing From: Texas
Country Missing From: USA

[attachmentid=423]

Circumstances: Ms. Wagner has capped teeth, a burn scar on her left calf and has a "high squeeky" voice. She was last seen wearing a pink jacket with fur trim on the collar and cuffs, a white sweater, jeans and tan 3/4 high boots.

You can contact the Missing Persons Clearinghouse at :

Missing Persons Clearinghouse
Texas Department of Public Safety
P O Box 4087
Austin, Texas 78773-0422

Printable Poster:
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/mpch/mpdetail...12:53:19PM'


Body of missing woman found in Amarillo lake
Associated Press
Jan. 20, 2005

AMARILLO -- The body of an Amarillo woman missing since just after Christmas was found today in a small lake near Interstate 40, near where her car had been found.

Kelly Katherine Wagner was last seen by her mother on Dec. 27 as the two left their house to run errands. They were supposed to meet later for dinner the same day, Wagner's 28th birthday.

Relatives on Thursday made a positive identification of Wagner, Amarillo police Sgt. Randy TenBrink said.

Police located her 2000 Land Rover in the parking lot of an apartment complex early Jan. 2. The passenger-side window of the vehicle had been smashed in, but several items inside were not taken.

The lake where the body was found is only about 300 yards from the lake.

Wagner's body will be taken to Lubbock for an autopsy, TenBrink said.

Police have said the circumstances of her disappearance led them to believe that foul play was involved.

Wagner was from a prominent Amarillo family. Her grandmother was Jeanne Howe Kritser, an Amarillo civic leader. Her great-grandfather was Gene Howe, who established the Amarillo Globe-News.

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/m...politan/3001544
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A vision sent me on the path of seeking justice for Chandra, nothing I've seen in print to date has diminished the vividness but only served to reaffirm the validity of this vision.


Last edited by peripeteia on Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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peripeteia



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

January 22, 2005

Autopsy Shows No Foul Play in Woman's Death

There are no signs of foul play in the death of an Amarillo woman, who had been missing for weeks, before her body was found, Thursday.

Late Friday afternoon, Amarillo Police received preliminary autopsy results for Kelly Katherine Wagner, 28. Wagner's body was pulled from Lawrence Lake, Thursday morning. She had been missing since December 27.

A private investigator hired by her family coordinated a sweep of the lake using cadaver dogs. Investigators tell us the preliminary autopsy does not show how Wagner died. Police say she may have drowned. They're still awaiting toxicology results, which could take six to eight weeks.

In the meantime, investigators ask anyone who saw Kelly on December 27, or who may have seen her around Lawrence Lake or Peppertree Square Apartments, to call Special Crimes at 378-9468.

http://www.kvii.com/home/headlines/1202397.html

I cannot find the story at the moment as it has been archived;
there was a fire at the Peppertree apt complex that completly destroyed the 24 unit apt. on the Jan. 7th. The police do not think the incidents are related. I wrote to the police and fire chief asking that the matter be reconsidered as there might be a relationship with the fire and covering of evidence in Kelly's murder. There might also be a possibility that the missing women in Lubbock are related to Kelly's murder. Perhaps there is a possibility that the women who worked in the Sandwich Shoppe with Joanna Rogers might be able to identify someone from the apt. Complex which was burned. It seems very coincidential, that Kelly's car was found on the 2nd. and that the apt. burns the following Friday. Wonder if anyone moved out of the apts. I know it seems a long stretch that the cases are related, however the police and investigators have turned up nothing in Lubbock regarding the murder and missing women there, which might mean that the person who is the perp in Lubbock might lived elsewhere and visit there occassional for business or other matters, like assaulting women.

Anyway perhaps their might be DNA evidence from the murdered women in Lubbock that might match Murdered women in Amarillo. I also sent the information about Joanna Rogers and Jennifer Wilkenson to the Globe newspaper in that they might draw some media attention to their cases and perhaps look at the coincidence of the fire that it might be to have covered up evidence. It is worth a try, nothing ventured, nothing gained!
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A vision sent me on the path of seeking justice for Chandra, nothing I've seen in print to date has diminished the vividness but only served to reaffirm the validity of this vision.


Last edited by peripeteia on Wed Jan 26, 2005 1:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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peripeteia



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PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apartment Fire Victims Start Over

01/08/05 AMARILLO - "It`s time to start over," said Kirk Lewis as he stood in the cold, watching his apartment burn Friday evening.
Despite efforts of fire fighters, the inside of Peppertree Apartment building B could not be saved. "What a way to spend my friday night" Kirk commented, "Everything I own is in that apartment. Everything. My money, my medicine, everything."
While he can`t get everything back, Amarillo`s Red Cross is providing money for food, clothing, and rent to help the victims of this fire, like Lewis, start over.
Emily Nolte, an Amarillo Red Cross volunteer said "It`s amazing how the dollars add up when you start rebuilding your lives." She was at the scene of the fire on Friday, talking to families and offering assistance.
One Amarillo College student lost his apartment as well, and because he did not know Red Cross was helping out until the next morning, he spent Friday night sleeping in his car. "I lost everything" said 22 year-old Tony Luangraj. "So, I wish I could`ve kept my safe deposit box or something like that. I didn`t grab anything, other than my keys and cell phone." But even without a home, he`s managed to stay upbeat by joking around that his bowling ball probably didn`t get ruined in the fire disaster. He told his friends, "Hey, I can bowling still."
Some good news for Luangraj: he didn`t have to spend another evening sleeping his car, because Red Cross set him up in a hotel for Saturday night. As for the other victims of the fire who`ve lost their home and everything in it, Red Cross said as of Saturday afternoon, they had only heard from about half of the families. But, they think it`s because some families were out of town when the fire happened, or others don`t know they can get help from Red Cross.
Building B had 24 units, and all were damaged by the fire. Fire officials say it was one of the largest fires in recent Amarillo history. They estimate the damage to be over $1 million, and are still investigating what the caused of the fire.
quoted from Fox news
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peripeteia



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2005 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It appears that the fire was started by someone lighting a fire in a fireplace, and that the fireplaces were faulty when built. That being the case I remain sceptical. It is rather an extrodinary coincidence. Like the coincidence of the robber across the street from the Peterson home shortly after Laci was murdered. I still FEEL that those events are related although the robbers to my knowledge were not presented in court to give testimony, even though they allegedly saw Scott Peterson in front of his house loading something on to a truck at 0230-0300 am on Christmas morning. Why they were not called to the witness stand is unfathomable.

I do not know when the Peppertree apts were built however it seems extrodinarily odd that one no one ever lit a fire in their fireplaces until Jan.7th. Although in my life I've never been to an apt. of that size (24 units) that had fireplaces. In this cold country that we live in here, being -20 celcius at the moment, I know of no apartment buildings that have fireplaces! NONE! I'm sure the fire department is doing a great job, however unless the building is brand new, it seems extrodinary that no one before now recognized that the fireplaces were faulty. No offense to fire department, but would not these fireplaces have to have been inspected and tried out before Jan.7th.

Hopefully the police are as sceptical as myself and dig real deep into the lives of the occupants of the Peppertree apt.

We have to wait for the toxicology reports to come back to determine if Kelly in fact was murdered, however, if Kelly did indeed kill herself, it is rather poor reporting on the part of the press to have mislead the public by keeping a lid on the fact that she may have been depressed or mentally unstable. It seems that someone so priveldged and had such a brillant future before her would have taken her life, and especially on her birthday, and the fact that she was off to run errands. Wow runs an errand before they are thinking of killing themselves, unless it is to procure drugs to do the job?

If Kelly was murdered, and if not there STILL remains a serial killer on the loose in Texas near and around Lubbock, with a several hundred mile radius. In researching the number of missing women especially teens on the internet in Texas, there were at least a half dozen young women who were reported missing and have later been found that did a walk about for a few days with a person that they meet on the internet. I hope that Texas and other states are considering and are teaching as part of the ciriculum the dangers of meeting someone on the internet. In Canada we have a poignant advertisement on TV of a young girl swinging on a swing in a park and the announcement says that she is waiting for a friend, then the swing is empty and still swinging and the announcement says that, it turns out that who the young girl was waiting for she meet on the internet and it turns out that he was not a friend at all!

The preliminary autopsy reports states that Kelly may have drowned, if she did drown she likely was thrown in the lake unconscious, as who drowns themselves in a small cold lake when they have finances to purchase a gun or drugs? If the medical examiner is stating that she may have drowned, then there should be water in Kelly's lungs. I hope the medical examiner has looked to see if she might have had a needle mark someonewhere on her body, as there are ways to kill a person which are difficult to detect, such as an overdose of potassium, insulin, digoxin as well as succhyinocholine (m.s), Pavalon, curare and other neuroparalyzing agents.....!!! Something had to render Kelly unconscious!



This is a picture taken recently Kelly, she hardly looks like she is in a state to set off on a mission to take her own life!?
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A vision sent me on the path of seeking justice for Chandra, nothing I've seen in print to date has diminished the vividness but only served to reaffirm the validity of this vision.


Last edited by peripeteia on Mon Jan 31, 2005 10:08 am; edited 2 times in total
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peripeteia



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Web-posted Wednesday, January 26, 2005
Autopsy of a Search


Parties hail APD efforts in Wagner case

By KRIS ABBEY
kris.abbey@amarillo.com
Amarillo Globe-News






Canine Expert: A dog called Aimme rides across Lawrence Lake on Thursday with Marta Brown, Carol Roberts and Bill Roberts of Panhandle Search and Rescue. The volunteers located the body of Kelly Katherine Wagner, who had been missing since Dec. 27.
Henry Bargas / henry.bargas@amarillo.com


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"Bush can not be held personally responsible for the death of servicemen/women in a war time situation. Those valiant men/women who serve our country in Iraq are doing so because of the 9/11 tragedy and the situations that resulted because of that. Many of our servicemen/women are embarrassed by the protests of the extremist who create and publish that kind of thing. I can say this because my son spent his time in Iraq with the USMC, may have to go again..." - From Wolfman [Join this discussion]









Lakeside Vigil: Robin and Sloan Kritser, family members of Kelly Katherine Wagner, wait with Sgt. Mark Brown of the Amarillo Police Department during a search Thursday at Lawrence Lake. Volunteers from the Panhandle Search and Rescue dog team found Wagner's body. The 28-year-old Amarillo woman had been missing since Dec. 27.
Henry Bargas / henry.bargas@amarillo.com




A private investigator involved in the search for Kelly Katherine Wagner said police did their part.
Wagner's family hired Larry Barlow shortly after the 28-year-old Amarillo woman went missing Dec. 27. The Amarillo Police Department also mounted a missing-person investigation. On Jan. 2, officers found Wagner's vehicle parked at Peppertree Terrace Apartments near Lawrence Lake. The Land Rover had a broken window and officers found some blood in the vehicle.

However, after all leads were exhausted, it was Barlow - rather than APD - who returned to "square one" and instigated the water search 2 weeks later at Lawrence Lake that led to the discovery of Wagner's body on Thursday.

Preliminary autopsy results showed no signs of foul play. With final autopsy results pending, police continue to investigate the case as a suspicious death.

Barlow said his role in the Wagner case was not the result of any dissatisfaction the family might have had with APD's handling of the case. He said the family hired him because an attorney advised them to.

"This wasn't a battle between a private investigator and the police department," he said.

Barlow, who served 30 years at APD before retiring in 1998, said APD has handled the case appropriately from the beginning.

"I think that they did exactly what I would expect the police to do. I think that they followed up every lead that I gave them," he said. "I feel like they did what they were supposed to do."

APD Sgt. Mark Brown, a former homicide investigator who now works in APD's detective division, is handling the case. He and Barlow coordinated the search that located Wagner's body. APD's dive team recovered the body.

The Potter-Randall Special Crimes Unit also is taking a role in the investigation now, though the case has not been declared a homicide. Barlow said the circumstances of the case did not call for earlier involvement by Special Crimes.

APD Cpl. Jerry Neufeld said Tuesday that Lt. Gary Trupe, Special Crimes Coordinator, will provide more details about Special Crimes' role as the case progresses. Investigators are waiting for final autopsy results including toxicology tests, which may indicate more about how Wagner died.

Neufeld said Trupe indicated he would make no further comments now about APD dive team procedures or the use of the search and rescue dog in the case.

APD and Special Crimes have come under criticism after the media learned that Barlow had contacted the Panhandle Search and Rescue dog team to do a search of Lawrence Lake.

Trupe and Brown made comments that day suggesting they did not arrange for the water search themselves because they did not know about the PANSAR team's qualifications and did not have access to the dogs.

PANSAR, a nonprofit group, has been operating in the area more than 10 years and has assisted in a number of high-profile cases including the search for Dorien Thomas, a 9-year-old Amarillo boy who disappeared in 1998.

Marta Brown, president of PANSAR, said she faults herself for not keeping local law enforcement agencies informed about her group and the capabilities of the dogs.

"We as handlers need to get the word out as far as what our dogs can do," Marta Brown said.

Aimme, the German Shepherd who located Wagner's body in Lawrence Lake, is a certified human-remains search dog and is trained to do "air scent" searches on land and water.

Marta Brown said Aimme has been certified for several years. Other dogs owned by PANSAR volunteers have been involved in land and water searches including a 145-day search at Lake Meredith after an Amarillo man and his three sons drowned while on a duck-hunting trip in 1996.

Marta Brown said Barlow and Mark Brown both met with her the day before the search to discuss logistics. Though Barlow was the one who located PANSAR and requested a search dog, APD immediately got involved, she said.

"I do not believe in any way, form or fashion that APD was dragging their feet," she said. "They acted on the information they had."

Mark Brown said in a previous interview that he and Barlow also both had searched the lake perimeter on foot before PANSAR was called in.

Another question that has hounded authorities is whether Wagner's death is linked to a fire on Jan. 7 that destroyed a building at Peppertree Terrace Apartments, the complex where police located Wagner's vehicle on Jan. 2.

Dennis Gwyn, a deputy fire marshal at the Amarillo Fire Marshal's Office, said he found nothing to suggest a connection between the fire and Wagner's disappearance.

Gwyn said the fire started accidentally after heat from a fire in a fireplace became intense enough to ignite structural materials in the space behind the fireplace.

He said his office has heard plenty of rumors about whether the Wagner case is related to the fire, but the only common factor seems to be location.

APD Sgt. Randy TenBrink said the department shares Gwyn's opinion.

"We don't believe there is any link between Kelly Wagner's death and the Peppertree Terrace apartment fire," TenBrink said. "We take it from the fire marshal about what the cause of the fire was and it has nothing to do with her death."
http://www.amarillo.com/stories/012605/new_1116291.shtml
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A vision sent me on the path of seeking justice for Chandra, nothing I've seen in print to date has diminished the vividness but only served to reaffirm the validity of this vision.
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laskipper



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with you, Peri, that Kelly doesn't look a bit depressed. Why she was at the Peppertree Apartment buildings (parking lot) is anyone's guess right now but as you mention- the fire looks like it's connected to me as well.

How often do they have apartment building fires?

You also point out that most apartments do not have fireplaces. That is true. In fact, I can't think of any in my area that have them. Texas would not have the need for fireplaces as we do up north. That would make it all the more of a rarity. Makes me wonder if the building codes- as relates to the installation of fireplaces- is somewhat lacking as result?

Could the fireplace have been more of a decorative type fireplace? One of those glass, cone shaped things that you see in magazines?

Whatever, it seems as though people who are new to making fires in a built-in fireplace may not know what they are doing. Pine wood creates a creosote and can cause the flue liner to go up in flames- which could have been what happened in this case? Also, you are not supposed to burn colored paper- such as the shiny stuff that most print-ad supplements in the newpapers contain. Many people don't know that either. The color in the paper creates the same dangerous build-up in the flue liner as burning pine. Maybe faster?

Hard to know what really happened. We can just hope that LE can get to the bottom of it.
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benn



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This may be going way way back, but women used to go out together more rather than alone. Then came women's liberation, but is it really liberation,? Women have the right to go out alone and be killed by almost any stranger, or they can be with a husband, or acquaintance, and still be killed. Some men are being killed the same way.

Maybe the fast transportation we have today has something to do with the murder rates. A killer can commit his evil deeds and be down the road 100 miles in no time flat. rd does not want women to wear locators, and I don't want anyone to have to wear locators, but maybe there will come a day when we will all have to wear locators, so that we don't become possible victims, or so that possible evil doers will not have a chance to do their evil.

Is that the 666 chip on the forehead as told in the bible? The world is rather peaceable today, even with all of the conflict. World commerce is possible, and that calls for a lot of co-operation among the countries of the world, but with all of the co-operation we are still as individuals unable to fully defend ourselves from the evil doers.

How can we have all of our freedom and still protect ourselves? It seems like we will have to give up some of our freedom so that we are more secure in our daily living.

Once in a while women are attacked in twos or threes, but most of the time it seems that the women who end up missing were alone. Unless, of course, they were with their husband or boyfriend.

It is sort of mind boggling.

benn
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jane



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If women used to only go out in pairs or groups, I never knew about it. Never heard of that, and I am in my 50's.
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peripeteia



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Web-posted Friday, January 21, 2005
Kelly Wagner's body found in Lawrence Lake




By Phillip Yates
phillip.yates@amarillo.com
Amarillo Globe-News






Tragic recovery: Amarillo Police Department divers, along with Amarillo firefighters and others, recover the body of Kelly Katherine Wagner from Lawrence Lake on Thursday. Wagner had been missing since Dec. 27.
Henry Bargas / henry.bargas@amarillo.com


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"Bush can not be held personally responsible for the death of servicemen/women in a war time situation. Those valiant men/women who serve our country in Iraq are doing so because of the 9/11 tragedy and the situations that resulted because of that. Many of our servicemen/women are embarrassed by the protests of the extremist who create and publish that kind of thing. I can say this because my son spent his time in Iraq with the USMC, may have to go again..." - From Wolfman [Join this discussion]









Search team: Members of Panhandle Search and Rescue K-9 Search Team - from left, Bill Roberts, Carol Roberts and Marta Brown - work with a dog called Aimme on Thursday in a search at Lawrence Lake for the body of a woman missing since Dec. 27. Aimme located the body of Kelly Katherine Wagner, 28.
Henry Bargas / henry.bargas@amarillo.com




Relatives of Kelly Katherine Wagner wept as they watched members of the Amarillo Police Department's dive team pull her body from the brackish waters of Lawrence Lake on Thursday.
The recovery of Wagner, 28, marked the end of a three-week nightmare for her family, said Robin Kritser, Wagner's aunt.

"It has been horrible," said Kritser, choking back the tears.

Despite the grief, the discovery of Wagner's body about noon, in some small way, assuaged the pain of not knowing where she is, Kritser said.

"It is incredible sadness and a glad sense of relief, I guess," Kritser said. "It was good to know."

The dive team recovered the body of Wagner after dogs with the Panhandle Search and Rescue team found her Thursday afternoon. Handlers of the search dogs said the animals are trained to primarily detect human scent.

Wagner belonged to a prominent Amarillo family. Her grandmother was Jeanne Howe Kritser, an Amarillo civic leader, and her great-grandfather was Gene Howe, who established the Amarillo Globe-News.

With an autopsy expected today, investigators with the Potter-Randall Special Crimes did not call Wagner's death a homicide Thursday afternoon.

Instead they called it a suspicious death because there was no visible trauma when her body was recovered, said Lt. Gary Trupe, coordinator of the special crimes unit.

"At this time, we don't see any signs of foul play," Trupe said. "It might be accidental, it could be suicidal, it could be homicidal. We will find out more about anything that may or may not have happened to her when we do the autopsy."

Trupe said Wagner's body was found about 10 feet away from the southeast shoreline of Lawrence Lake. Her body was submerged in more than a foot of water, Trupe said.

"She was slightly visible from the shoreline," Trupe said. According to police at the scene, Wagner had the same clothes on that she did the last time anyone saw her.

Wagner's body was found within a half mile from where police found her blue Land Rover Discovery on Jan. 2 at the Peppertree Terrace Apartments, said Cpl. Jerry Neufeld of the Amarillo Police Department.

When police discovered the vehicle, one window was smashed to pieces and several items in her car were not taken, leading police to believe Wagner's disappearance involved foul play, Neufeld said.

Sgt. Mark Brown, lead investigator into Wagner's disappearance, declined to reveal more details.

Brown said that although both he and Larry Barlow, the private investigator Wagner's family hired to investigate her disappearance, have combed the lake several times, Thursday was the first time search dogs used.

The Amarillo Police Department does not have dogs that are trained like the ones used to find Wagner's body, Trupe said.

"I wasn't aware that we had dogs in the area that were certified in the water, and it turns out that we do," Brown said. "As soon as we found out, we immediately got a hold of them."

Barlow, who organized the effort to bring the dogs to Lawrence Lake on behalf of the Wagner family, said that although discovery of her body will not end their grief, it can give them some sense of peace.

"I am relieved a lot for the family," Barlow said. "They can put a period at the end of the sentence and go on with their lives."

Sam Hilliard, a spokesman for the Wagner-Krister family, said relatives were coping the best they could after hearing news that Wagner's body was found.

"I think they are doing OK under the circumstances," Hilliard said. "To lose her this way is just devastating. She had everything going for her."

Hilliard said Wagner's mother, Gail Wagner, had made a point to meet the search dogs before they went to look for her daughter.

"She wanted on some level to connect with the dogs that were going to search for her daughter," Hilliard said.

Despite the grief at losing her, Wagner's family offered warm thanks to the community that helped them through the time she was missing.

"I want to thank the Amarillo community for their prayer and support the last three weeks," said Kritser, who also thanked the Amarillo Police Department, complimenting them for their hard work, diligence and professionalism.

But Kritser reserved a special thanks for Barlow, who helped the family through Wagner's disappearance.

"He has just been an amazing tower of strength," Kritser said.


Timeline

Kelly Katherine Wagner's Disappearance:

Dec. 27: Kelly Katherine Wagner misses a family dinner to celebrate her birthday. It is the last day the family had any contact with her.

Dec. 29: Wagner's family reports her missing.

Jan. 2, 1:30 a.m.: Police find Wagner's car, a blue Land Rover Discovery in the 2600 block of Linda Circle, next to Peppertree Terrace Apartments. Circumstances surrounding her vehicle lead police to believe her disappearance involved foul play.

Jan. 20: After a Panhandle Search and Rescue team scours Lawrence Lake with rescue dogs for a half hour, police find Wagner's body. Wagner's body is found almost a half mile from where her car was found.


http://www.amarillo.com/stories/012105/new_1079842.shtml



http://www.team4news.com/Global/story.asp?S=2860015

AMARILLO, Texas A preliminary autopsy report indicates no trauma or foul play in the death of an Amarillo woman whose body was found in a small lake last week.

Kelly Katherine Wagner had been missing for more than three weeks when authorities pulled the 28-year-old's body from Lawrence Lake in Amarillo last Thursday.

The lake is about 300 yards from where police found her car January Second. The passenger-side window of her blue 2000 Land Rover Discovery had been smashed, but several items inside weren't taken.

Police say there were no indications that Wagner was shot, stabbed, struck or strangled. Nevertheless, they continue to investigate the death as suspicious.

A final autopsy report is pending.

Wagner was from a prominent Amarillo family. Great-grandfather Gene Howe established the Amarillo Globe-News newspaper.

___

Information from the Amarillo Globe-News, http://www.amarillo.com
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A vision sent me on the path of seeking justice for Chandra, nothing I've seen in print to date has diminished the vividness but only served to reaffirm the validity of this vision.
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benn



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jane, I am fairly certain that a lot of women did that. I am 78 as of this month. I would have to do some more research on that. I did not have any sisters, so I do not have a lot of first hand information. We are living in a fairly modern world. Just fifty or 100 years ago the world was not so modern and still is not modern in a lot of the world. I will see if I can find anything about women going out in groups.

The word chaperon sort of rings a bell, but I don't have a good description of all that chaperon means. That comes from Middle French also. That is not exactly quite what I meant, but that is one version of going out in groups.

While I was posting this, Peri posted ahead of me.

benn
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peripeteia



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2005 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Web-posted Saturday, January 22, 2005
Wagner autopsy shows no foul play


Police say drowning possible cause of death

By GREG CUNNINGHAM
greg.cunningham@amarillo.com
Amarillo Globe-News






Kelly Wagner: Autopsy results indicate that foul play was likely not involved in her death. Police found the body of the 28-year-old professional photographer Thursday at Lawrence Lake.



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TALK AMARILLO
"Bush can not be held personally responsible for the death of servicemen/women in a war time situation. Those valiant men/women who serve our country in Iraq are doing so because of the 9/11 tragedy and the situations that resulted because of that. Many of our servicemen/women are embarrassed by the protests of the extremist who create and publish that kind of thing. I can say this because my son spent his time in Iraq with the USMC, may have to go again..." - From Wolfman [Join this discussion]









Body Found: Robin and Sloan Kritser visit with Sgt. Mark Brown after identifying the body of Kelly Katherine Wagner on Thursday.
Henry Bargas / henry.bargas@amarillo.com












An autopsy conducted on the body of Kelly Katherine Wagner on Friday afternoon revealed no signs of trauma or foul play.
Lt. Gary Trupe, coordinator of the Potter-Randall Special Crimes Unit, said preliminary autopsy results seem to indicate foul play was not involved in the death of Wagner, whose body was recovered Thursday from Lawrence Lake after the 28-year-old had been missing for about three weeks.

"Right now, it looks like there were no outside forces that caused an injury," Trupe said. "Normally, you'd look for things like bullet wounds, stab wounds, blunt force trauma or strangulation, but nothing they can find indicates that an outside person or source caused any injury."

Trupe said drowning is a possible cause of death, but no official determination will be made until toxicology and microscopic examinations are completed, which can take six weeks.

Wagner went missing sometime about Dec. 27, when she missed a family dinner that was held to celebrate her birthday. Her vehicle was found Jan. 2 in the parking lot of the Peppertree Terrace Apartments, 2601 S. Linda Circle. A window of the Land Rover had been broken out, but items in the car were not stolen.

Trupe said investigators still don't know how the window got broken, but he pointed out that the vehicle was sitting unattended in the lot for several days, apparently with the dome light on for much of that time.

Dogs trained to find bodies were brought to Lawrence Lake on Thursday, less than a half mile from where the vehicle was found, and the Amarillo Police Department dive team recovered Wagner's body.

Trupe said he had heard reports that the lake level had dropped since investigators first checked out the area, which could have made finding the body easier.

Even though foul play is unlikely, special crimes will keep the case and continue to try to find out what happened to Wagner, Trupe said. Investigators are looking for anybody who saw Wagner on or after Dec. 27 to help them piece together what happened to her.

"For the family, I'd like to figure out how she got into the lake," Trupe said. "Maybe somebody out there could fill in any gaps. I don't think we've been able to answer that question of how she got from point A to point B."

Anyone with information should contact special crimes at 378-9468.

Services for Wagner are scheduled for 2 p.m. today at First Presbyterian Church.

http://amarillo.com/stories/012205/new_1089098.shtml
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A vision sent me on the path of seeking justice for Chandra, nothing I've seen in print to date has diminished the vividness but only served to reaffirm the validity of this vision.
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peripeteia



Joined: 22 Sep 2002
Posts: 1173
Location: Nova Scotia

PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2005 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Benn:

I'm in my fifties also, and have travelled alone half around the world and back, lived until I was in my late forties before I locked my doors. My sisters (2) and myself went where we wanted and when we wanted. the world now has three times the number of people that it had in 1970 and it was estimated that the population would grow to 4 billion by 2000 by the intellectuals of the world. Well they were grossly wrong. This is part of the problem.

In the neck of the woods that I come from, it was unheard of women being assaulted, well this has all changed, the world has gone to hell in a hand basket. But surely we have the right to go out alone. The case in point, she left in the morning or afternoon. Women are being attacked in their home, on the streets and in parking lots, shopping centres and out in front of houses while they walk home, in parks, everywhere.

What needs to happen is that the law needs clout, the punishments must be more severe, we must take porno off the TV, off the internet and there should be mamouth fine for those who produce snuff, XXX movies and child pornograph, and the sex trade. We must take all their monies as fines, including their houses, no getting off my having property in someone elses name, i.e. wife or children. We must put more monies into law enforcement training, and expand the forces, their salaries need to be increased and departments of L.E. must share information. Many women are aware of what their spouse or boyfriend is up to, especially in incest, these women must be charged as well for witholding information. We must consider that those who are victims of sexual assault their lives are for ever ruined, they are forever scared and afraid. This is also true of men who are sexually assaulted.

Law enforcement turns their back to the suffering of those in prison, who are being sexually assaulted. There are many people in positions of power that have ties to the sex industry. The public needs a wake up call, there are 100,000 missing person in the united states, with thousands of unsolved murders and likely hundreds of thousands of unsolved sexual crimes.

Women as well as men have the right to go out alone. Children have the right to go out and play. We are not safe is the admission that we must make, and the question becomes why are we not screaming on in the congress and in the Parliament of our countries for this to change!!????

We know that pedophiles cannot be reabilitated given the present modes of treatment, therefore, why are we not considering castration?! This is very real option! We give people frontal labotomies when they are very violent, but castration is off limits, WHY!!!? Many of those who make laws and in positions of power are guilty of sexual offenses and thus the ability to change the laws are diminished. For example, why was Condit not removed from his position of power, did he not prey on young women, when he began to go out with Joleen MacKay she was barely of age. There is also Jennifer Thomas, which has not been investigated, was she not underage? Was not Clinton in the same boat? Yes they may have had consentual sex, but is this who we want for leaders, are they going to be the law makers who will attack the sex trade? I think NOT!

In Nova Scotia we have a Senator named Gerald Regan, from Halifax (Beford), he was indited for numberous sexual offenses, over a peroid of 30 or more years many dating back to the late fifties and sixties. There was a trial, and suddenly after about a year the case was laid to rest. What message does this send to the public, that it is OK!!! This is an infatima, many of these women whom he attacked lives have been ruined. Gerald Regan remains in our Senate!!! It was and is public knowledge that Gerald Regan is a sexual predator.

We cannot have people in positions of power and law enforcement who are sexual predators or who cannot control their own sexual urges! Full disclosure of candidates must take place and those whose behavoir is not fitting for an elected representative must be removed. This includes those in law enforcement, especially judges

Condit was able to plead the 5th and walk away from the grand jury regarding Chandra's disappearance and murder even though it is a known fact that he witheld vital information during a critical period of Chandra gone missing! Why has this been allowed to happen? Because the public is silent?! Why has the grand jury not reconveined since Condit no longer holds public office?

The jig is up, but before laws can change, the people must rise up and make their opinions known and lobby for the laws to change. Our streets, homes and backyards and parks must be made safe again, and we women have the right to go out and about by ourselves.
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