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For the prosecution

 
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9273
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 3:07 am    Post subject: For the prosecution Reply with quote

What are the issues for the prosecution in examining Chandra Levy's case? What role should Stanislaus County play in investigating her disappearance and murder? This thread examines those issues.

The hot spots for Stanislaus County I can quickly summarize here. They would be investigating the Jennifer Thomas connection, the reason for Stanislaus County being ordered not to investigate the disappearance of their local citizen who was last associated with their local congressman, California's grand jury initiative and whether this case now would be seen as having at least investigative jurisdiction, and victims issues concerning the right to know what is happening in the investigation of the murder of their daughter in a federal district.

Many, many issues, some legal, some constitutional, many just plain criminal investigative issues that need to be investigated. We'll expand on these in following posts.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9273
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A jog in the park

One of the fundamental questions is, why should the prosecution concern itself with looking into the life of someone murdered jogging in a park? This unfortunately happens occasionally, and investigating the circumstances surrounding Chandra's disappearance is not going to turn up a random attacker in a park, so whether Guandique or another attacker, there's not much to do except wait for another attack. If there's not another one, well Guandique is in jail.

That is where the case stands, but should it be? Instead of a jogging trail in a park, what if it were described it as a horse trail in a national forest, a horse trail up the side of a mountain? Should we think Chandra was jogging up the side of a mountain on a horse trail in a deep, dark forest?

Instead of murdered jogging in a park, what if it were described it as dumped down the hillside below a picnic spot where a vehicle can be backed up to the horse trail? Shouldn't that be the way it is described, and isn't that so much different than a random attacker in a park?

And when we consider Chandra's dumped body down that steep slope, and consider that it was taken there and hidden and not found for a year, when we consider that her jewelry was taken but not pawned, when we consider the trail and the slope are too steep to sit without sliding, her body bound with her stockings, should we describe it as a sexual attack or a body dumped after being murdered elsewhere?

Chandra could have been abducted by a stranger and murdered, but a hidden body and missing but unpawned jewelry point toward someone who knew her, not a random attacker in a deep, dark forest, a forest that no woman would be found alone in alive.

The focus of an investigation of a murdered woman should be the intimates until ruled out. Who was Chandra's lover and has this intimate been ruled out? This the prosecution of Stanislaus County should question in an examination of Chandra Levy's case.

A jog in the park it was not.

rd
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9273
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A Modesto connection to Chandra's murder?

Questions concerning Chandra's murder follow a predictable path. Was she in a sexual relationship with Gary Condit, congressional representative of her hometown of Modesto?

Yes, but so what, so were many other women, including Anne Marie Smith at the same time, unbeknownst to each other.

Was Chandra found in a park within a mile or two of where a man named Guandique brutally attcked and attempted to subdue two different joggers just weeks after Chandra disappeared?

Yes, and that's where the questions end.

But the questions should just begin there. Regardless of Condit's definitions of friendship and relationship as applied to his mistresses, Condit was known by Chandra's parents to be a mentor to her in Washington concerning her aspirations for a career with the FBI.

And regardless of whether true or not, the Levys in Modesto were told by their gardener that his daughter had had an emotionally traumatic affair with Condit a few years earlier.

Although the gardener's story is now in dispute, this much is not. Susan Levy called her daughter with the gardener at her side and warned Chandra about what she had just been told about Condit. And then on a visit to Washington, Chandra told her mother that Condit had explained it all.

The very next week Chandra was shocked to be told that her government internship was over and to clean out her desk, and a few days later, little more than two weeks after Chandra said that Condit had explained it all to her, she disappeared.

What had Condit explained? The Fifth Amendment is his only answer. But there are many questions that need to be investigated that don't require an answer from Condit, and they need to be answered by those who do know.

The gardener's daughter name is Jennifer Thomas. Whether she had an affair with Condit or not, she had a son during the time her father said she was in an affair with Condit. The father's name is withheld from the son's birth certificate.

Who is the father? Whoever it is, the daughter was so terrified she fled the state to avoid answering questions from the FBI. The daughter is terrified, Chandra is dead after talking about it to Condit.

Is there a Modesto connection to Chandra's murder? The questions should not stop at Condit and Guandique. They should begin.

rd
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benn



Joined: 19 Sep 2002
Posts: 2136
Location: Sacramento, CA

PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Somewhere Chandra Levy's murderer(s) is walking loose, unless he
(they) are in jail or prison for some other crime. No matter who the
murderer or murderers are, law enforcement should be looking for them.
Any law enforcement agency who is aware of what happened to Chandra
Levy and who can do anything to help solve the crime should be doing
so. That is what law enforcement is for, to maintain the peace and
security. Otherwise we would have vigilante law, which is not acceptable.

>>> Questions concerning Chandra's murder follow a predictable path. Was
she in a sexual relationship with Gary Condit, congressional representative
of her hometown of Modesto?

Yes, but so what, so were many other women, including Anne Marie Smith at
the same time, unbeknownst to each other.<<<

Police Chief Ramsey told reporters "We're not the sex police here," but what
does that mean? Maybe he meant that the Washington police are not trying to
enforce morality. I don't know if they try to enforce morality or not. I think they
do look for missing persons and for dead bodies and for murderers.

Chandra's remains were found in Rock Creek Park, and it was determined that
she had been murdered. Where she was murdered we don't know, and the
circumstances of her murder we don't know. A horrible event, and all the more
reason that law enforcement anywhere, and by whatever means, should be
looking for the person(s) who committed the crime, just as law enforcement
should be looking for all other criminals.

Who would have wanted to kill Chandra Levy? Why would someone have wanted
to kill her? A mugger or a rapist in Rock Creek Park might have killed Chandra,
but if someone did kill her there they did a good job of hiding the body. Who
else might have wanted to kill Chandra? Maybe no one wanted to kill Chandra,
but she was just in the way and the personal security of the person(s) who
committed the crime might have required that she be silenced forever through
death.

So we get back to the sex police. Whether sex was involved or not Condit was
involved in dating women other than his wife. I am not the sex police, also I do
not live in former Congressman Condit's congressional district. Condit was a
good vote getter, and his congressional career depended upon his getting as
many votes as possible at election time. Like many people I had never heard
about Gary Condit, until Chandra Levy disappeared, but in looking back at his
record it looked as if he would be in Congress for a long time. He was also
smart enough to play both sides of the aisle in Congress. In retrospect it looked
like he had it made. What then could spoil his career, interupt it?

Congressmen are elected by the voters in their districts. Condit had "Condit
country," politics well under control in his district. He had it made. Unless there
might be something that would change the minds of the voters in his district.
What could change the minds of his voters? We know that the minds of his
voters did change, because they voted him out of office, in the primary.

The voters had found out a little more about Gary Condit. Something similar
has happened to other Senators and Congressmen in Congress. Sometimes
the voters in a district find out that their elected official is doing something that
they don't approve of. Senators and Congressmen come and go, but most of
them seem to get re-elected. What did Gary Condit do wrong?

What Condit seems to have done wrong is to have had affairs with women other
than his wife. Whatever his reasons that is all that we can deduce from the
meager information that we have about his affairs. What Condit had going for him
is that very few people knew about his affairs, and those who seem to have known
only knew about some of his affairs, not all of them.

So how did Condit get exposed, to his constituents? He got exposed when
Chandra Levy disappeared. Chandra had began talking to her family about
Congressman Condit, and such talk could eventually begin to expose Condit's
secret life as a Congressman having affairs. That kind of exposure could change
the minds of his voters, and keep him from getting re-elected.

So how was Condit so lucky in keeping all of his women acquaintences silent for
so long? Maybe by his silency rule for the women he dated in private? Anyway,
dead or alive Chandra Levy exposed Condit's secret life. Was the threat of
exposure enough to cause Condit, and maybe a friend or two, to want to make
Chandra disappear?

Law enforcement does not really appear to have looked into any motive that
Condit might have had for wanting Chandra to disappear, to be silenced. That
is law enforcement's job, whether it be in Washington, or in Stanislaus County.
Stanislaus County handled the Scott Peterson case, against all kinds of odds;
maybe Stanislaus County could do a good job of handling the Chandra Levy
murder investigation. There are a lot of clues and evidence that does not seem
to have been looked at very closely the first time around.

Right now the best the public can seem to do to get the case solved is to try
to stir law enforcement into action, wherever that law enforcement might be.
A private eye might be able to solve the case, but that could take millions of
dollars of private money, and we have police departments to try to solve crimes,
whether the crimes be sexual, or non sexual.

benn
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propria



Joined: 20 Sep 2002
Posts: 630
Location: northern illinois

PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for your summaries ... let's hope they are seen by someone in a position to make a difference who is willing to take action where no other law enforcement operation has been willing to do that. i understand that there must be a nexus, some form of connection, between the crime being investigated and the distant county investigating it, and i hope that intimidation of witnesses [the thomas family] in that distant county will be adequate to establish investigative jurisdiction ... there is a reason why jennifer thomas disappeared and her father recanted, and law enforcement has a right to know why they did that.

i'd also like to think that there are at least a few law enforcement officials in that district who are curious as to why their assistance was so summarily dismissed when they offered it at the time of chandra's disappearance. even at that time, i thought it was odd to reject an offer for assistance that certainly would not have impaired any local investigation underway, and i hope now that the jurisdictional basis relied on in making that early offer will become the basis for conducting an investigation that has not been and will not be conducted where this crime was committed. if there is going to be any justice for chandra levy and her family, it's going to have to be found in her own back yard because nobody is willing to even look for it anywhere else.


nanci
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rd



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 9273
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should Stanislaus County investigate the murder of one of their own in Washington, DC?

Should they investigate their congressman in Washington at the time who was involved with her when she disappeared?

Should jurisdiction be abdicated to local Washington, DC police, even after the Washington police have sat on it as a cold case?

Is it even known who has jurisdiction over Chandra's murder? The Washington police publically turned it over to the FBI more than two years ago. The FBI hadn't even obtained her autopsy report from the DC coroner more than a year later.

Does the FBI have jurisdiction, and are they ordering Stanislaus County not to investigate as the Washington, DC police did?

If a Modesto resident took his girlfriend to Canada or an Indian reservation or a national park or Washington, DC and returned without her, who would investigate the woman's disappearance?

And would Stanislaus County be ordered to turn over any information they had to federal authorities and not to investigate as the Washington, DC police ordered Stanislaus County? Is that legally and constitutionally acceptable?

Should Stanislaus County order Washington, DC to turn over copies of its investigation into their citizen's disappearance while being involved with their congressman?

What if their citizen was involved with another congressman? Does that make it a federal investigation, or is a local community allowed to find out for the grieving family what has become of a murder investigation that was maybe too inconvenient for the city of Congress to handle?

Is it acceptable for police to sit on an investigation, releasing no information to the family, under the guise that it is under investigation? How does one know it is?

When does sitting on something as Washington bureaucrats do as a form of refusing to do something become a refusal to investigate a congressman out of fear of offending those who fund them?

Anne Marie Smith sought a California grand jury to investigate Condit. The grand jury found that Washington, DC has jurisdiction.

Would that be found today, and is that acceptable to California residents?

It shouldn't be. Stanislaus County should review the investigation of Chandra Levy's murder and assume responsibility for answering all outstanding questions in the case.

It is their citizens and their grieving family. If they don't, no one will.

rd
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